Forum:No more Wikia
- This is no voting for anything. It's just a petition to have Uncyclomedia projects liberated from Wikia for ever. Read the text from my letter carefully and say if you agree or not. No one is compulsory to agree, but the more people who agree, the merrier it is to convince Wikia Inc.
I hope many of you will support this. This is very important if we don't want to have Wikia involved in our projects ever again. Thank you | Cartoonist | Talk to God! OMFG, HE WENT BANANAS!!! | 12:58, 24 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
This is an official letter from UnMeta to Wikia.
Dear Wikia Staff,
Since 2006 Uncyclomedia.org has assisted the Uncyclopedia-concept in multilingual coordination, it has served as a central wiki to request adoptions and creations of new languages. Sadly, Uncyclopedia moved to Wikia, but Wikia abused (and still does) the concept by giving people the opportunity to create new languages and by commercialising the concept. That was no part of the deal. The umbrella organisation is Uncyclomedia (often abbreviated as UnMeta), Wikia stole Uncyclomedia’s role for its commercial purposes. Also, Wikia just took over Uncyclopedia’s domain name .org. As Wikia is commercial, the company has no right to use such domains. Unfortunately, indeed, many wikis moved to Wikia and new languages were created on it. Many people got very angry about this injustice against Uncyclomedia and some Uncyclomedia users started up Complaintwiki.org, where they posted their complaints about Wikia. I refer to the license Attribution-Noncommercial-Share Alike 2.5 Generic, that the work may not be used for commercial purposes. The ‘work’ also includes de concept itself, so Wikia is not even allowed to create new languages.
I, CartoonistHenning, have had very bad experiences with Wikia.com, according to the fact that I made a lot of efforts to let close some copied Uncyclopedias/Illogicopedias in other languages. The Uncyclopedia-concept is meant to be a Wikipedia parody, which also includes the freedom of ads (non-commercial), the freedom of users (bureaucrats cannot do on their wiki what they want to do) and the default skin (no Monaco). On page two of this letter I explain why Wikia Inc. never deserved the acquisition of the Uncyclopedia-concept.
Therefor we postulate that the abandoned Uncyclopedias in other languages on Wikia will be removed and that Wikia will no more accept new Uncyclopedias in other languages. Wikia should no more be involved with the Uncyclopedia-concept in other languages, except the wikis that asked for a move and that are active on Wikia. The same goes for another non-commercialised project, like the Illogicopedia-group, which will not be afflicted by Wikia anymore, despite the rude copy which is today called Wackypedia. To make sure that this requirement is confirmed by Uncyclomedia users - who share the same opinion -, people can read this document too and tell in a forum if they agree, like a petition.
Sincerely,
Henning VD, CartoonistHenning
-- page 2 --
Reasons and arguments why Wikia does not care about a project concept, but only (ab)uses projects to make money out of them and the people.[edit source]
§1. The agreement concerning the hosting is unilaterally enforced:
Once people want to make a new language of the Uncyclopedia-concept, for instance, (ignorant of the truth about the fact that Uncyclomedia is the real hosting) they make a domain for free on Wikia, but they do not realise that
A: they commercialise the name of (the) Uncyclopedia(-concept);
B: if they do not want to have the Uncyclopedia-version on Wikia anymore, they are planning to move, or they start realising Wikia commercialises the concept in a unfair way, it is too late to start over again. Wikia let projects never go and (ab)uses the Wikia wiki as a direct competition, kept by Wikia users who requested the adoption for the wiki. The content of the abandoned wiki will remain, so Wikia does not give people the freedom in what they do. Users should read a kind of manual before creating a wiki on Wikia. But no, the green inviting button above each wiki “create a new wiki” leads you directly to the creation scheme, without any warnings.
C: they even have never heard about the Uncyclomedia Foundation, because Wikia is so predominant in Google, that they didn’t find any information about the real organisation.
This is actually all about selling your soul to the devil: once in Wikia, never out.
§2. Wikia is playing a game with people when they talk about the ‘community’:
“Our community wants you; we are happy to see you joining our community...” and nonsense. This horse manure is a typical trick to attract people to Wikia. The company claims that you and your early community will be safe with your Uncyclopedia-version and you and your community can decide everything on your project. In fact, Wikia means with ‘community’ something totally different than you expected: the community is the team of janitors and staff members who control you, your wiki and your community to lead everything like ‘they’ want to. A clear example is the complaint according to a fight between User:D. G. Neree and User:Manticore about home rules on the creator’s wiki, a complaint which can be found on Complaintwiki.org. Janitors and staff members just come over to your wiki and do inappropriate edits. Administrators are chosen in the understanding that they know the wiki’s general policy very well, but these janitors and staff members do not seem to worry about that wiki’s policy. They have their own rules, haven’t they? It appears that Wikia has a goal to become the largest communistic society on planet Earth, as they claim to love a big and grand community of hard working people, but actually gain money on these volunteers, who eventually have nothing as compensation (except irritating ads, no freedom in ruling their wiki like they want, etc...). Maybe you can interpret ‘community’ in two different ways, as following:
- a large group of volunteers that is oppressed by the company, to make as much money out of them as Wikia can. You will join this ‘community’ and be a small part of the commercial company yourself, without receiving any compensation for it. That is why Wikia wants you.
- Wikia itself, which includes the staff, the janitors and everyone who gets paid for the volunteer’s work. The ‘community’ decides? Certainly not: the staff members and janitors do!
§3. Wikia has no respect for the Attribution-Noncommercial-Share Alike 2.5 Generic license:
I will not explain it over and over again. The license does not allow to use/copy non-profit organisations for commercial purposes. Wikia Inc. is commercial. Obviously, Wikia is a very crafty business.
Do you agree with the text?[edit source]
If you have signed this petition before on Ikkepedia, Desciclopedia, Oncyclopedia or Illogicopedia, please don't sign it here. Each user on a Uncyclomedia project can sign here (don't forget to mention your home wiki then). The petition will close July, 8.
- I already voted on UnMeta - Cartoonist | Talk to God! OMFG, HE WENT BANANAS!!! | 12:58, 24 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- Hell yes. Henning, you are a revolutionary. --T3 21:04, 24 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
Discussion[edit source]
Guys, I need your support in this. The same topic is going on at UnclePetepedia. We should react right now | Cartoonist | Talk to God! OMFG, HE WENT BANANAS!!! | 12:42, 25 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- Encouraging people to basically flood Uncyclopedia? Pretty sure that's a bannable offense over there. I'll continue to respond on Uncyc rather than here because this is a happy place!! Dexter111344 14:23, 25 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- I posted the petition here too, because Illogicopedia has been irritated by Wikia since their move. I felt it was my duty to post the petition on every wiki which doesn't want to have anything to do with Wikia no more | Cartoonist | Talk to God! OMFG, HE WENT BANANAS!!! | 17:48, 25 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- In your comments about Wikia's oddball definition of "community" you miss one key point - when Wikia manages to alienate a contributor or group of contributors (in Illogicopedia's case, that would've been pretty much all of the active authors on this site) eventually those contributors will take their content and go elsewhere. Not that I blame them, evidently. At that point, expect to see Wikia, Wikia's staff or Wikia apologists offer nonsense along the lines of "they're not members of the community anymore, they left... so their concerns may be ignored" and possibly even removal of information as to where all those once-key contributors had moved. At that rate, what is the "Wackypedia community" in Illogicopedian terms? Sounds like the sound of one hand clapping. The only difference between nonsense like "In regards to seniority, I definitely have more than you seeing as how I haven't only edited on my talk page or in forums that are anti-Wikia for several years. I know the full history of the site and even how you actually made a single feature. I've also put some of your articles on VFD before. That's what all those red links are on your page. I'm thinking of rewriting everything you've ever made just to spite you now." (on en.uncyc's version of this discussion) and Wikia staffers' claim that "the community" at the now-abandoned Wikia verson of Illogicopedia just conveniently is anyone except those who moved here after Wikia destroyed the site with forced, ad-heavy reskins is that Wikia would have omitted the counterproductive personal attack and just stuck to the (albeit implausible) pretext that "the community" may be skewed to mean "the community, ignoring a long list of regular contributors who are leaving or have left because they have been alienated by what we have done". Amazing what one can do statistically if you can choose whatever self-selected sample serves your ends, no?
- The petition text probably could've focussed more specifically on the one specific issue: Wikia's use of claims that "other Uncyclopedias, including en:, are hosted there" in their repeated attempts to pressure individual admins or even individual users into turning ownership of various non-Wikia projects over to them is dishonest, as en: did not choose to have their domain sold out from under them. That was done in secret, by one of the founders (not a sole founder) at UnclePete, and met at the time with very strong objections from users and contributors. It was not appropriate that one individual act to undermine what was the work of many. That those objections have consistently stopped just short of forking the entire project to move the site elsewhere is not the point; read the archives, this is still a rather serious matter and Wikia might want to consider simply leaving en.uncyclopedia's name out of their over-aggressive sales pitches as this borders on deliberately misleading. --Carlb 15:25, 26 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- Sure, you're so right about all that. I talk in a general way about a situation which corresponds with the most of the Uncyclomedia-wikis. I know Wikia has approached every wiki in a different way, but I posted the petition not only to let users agree with it, but to give users the opportunity to give complementairy arguments (like you did now) | Cartoonist | Talk to God! OMFG, HE WENT BANANAS!!! | 21:00, 27 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- I don't really wanna comment too much on the Uncyc Wikia issue because it's a different kettle of fish to what happened with us. New Monacogate was basically a clash of interests. As for Uncyc, the adverts suck but at least they get to choose their own skins. Swings and roundabouts. -- Hindleyak Converse • ?blog • Click here! 10:16, 28 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- Ironic, though, that the same Uncyclopedians who get so offended at anything in this petition which they perceive to be a demand that en: move to a non-Wikia host fail to grasp that Oncyclopedians are just as offended (or more so) at the repeated, unsolicited Wikia solicitations which they perceive as an attempt to demand that nl: move off whatever non-Wikia host happens to be in use at the time. I guess it works both ways? The en: project needs to have the ability to decide for themselves where to host (en:User:Chronarion's selling the uncyclopedia.org domain out from them compromises this autonomy, but sadly a few of their current admins are too n00b to actually read the history of this back to at least 2006 and familiarise themselves with the issues affecting their home wiki - their ignorance of nl:, pt: or whatever else is one thing, but en: itself?). The nl: project needs to retain the ability to decide for themselves where to host, again without interference from anyone on en:, Wikia or anyone else. That works both ways.
- Perhaps the petition should've been worded more narrowly (to focus just on the issue of outsiders trying to pressure Oncyclopedia to change hosts, and to explain in a dumbed-down fashion that the issue does affect en: as Wikia's use of "but many of the other Uncyclopedias are hosted there" is dragging en: into this by inferring that en: as a community voluntarily chose to be Wikia-controlled. I was one of the en: admins at the time that one individual, Jonathan Huang (en:user:Chronarion) sold the name out from under the project in secret. We did not voluntarily choose to become Wikia-controlled; that was forced on us in a sleazy backroom deal, which ultimately did harm the project as our pages are no longer served on "uncyclopedia.org" but on the far less-professional "uncyclopedia.wikia.com". Heck, why not try for "uncyclopedia.geocities.com" (it still existed at the time) and make the transition complete? I wouldn't expect en: to be aware of issues like the pt: trademark disputes (Wikia kept registering "desciclopedia.net", "desciclopedia.info" and the like at one point in which they thought they could convince pt: to move; Desciclopédia was ultimately moved from a rented server to co-location without a new domain name or a change in control but the continued Wikia cybersquatting meant having to pursue trademark and UDRP remedies at over-$1000 in cost to liberate "desciclopedia.org" from spammers (that domain was squatted by a Domain Park Ltd., hiding behind a UPS Berlin mail drop box, a Philly 'phone number and another address somewhere in Apia, Samoa; they stupidly switched registrars to one in Nepean, Ontario after the UDRP complaint had been filed based in part on a Canadian trademark pair). I would, however, expect an en: admin to be aware of the full history of en: and, even by that metric, many of the current "look at me, I'm so important, I ban everyone who expresses views with which I disagree" brigade fall dangerously short. I feel sorry for en.uncyc and what it's become, although I realise that is neither Illogicopedia nor any other wiki's problem. --Carlb 14:45, 28 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- Sure, you're so right about all that. I talk in a general way about a situation which corresponds with the most of the Uncyclomedia-wikis. I know Wikia has approached every wiki in a different way, but I posted the petition not only to let users agree with it, but to give users the opportunity to give complementairy arguments (like you did now) | Cartoonist | Talk to God! OMFG, HE WENT BANANAS!!! | 21:00, 27 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
- I posted the petition here too, because Illogicopedia has been irritated by Wikia since their move. I felt it was my duty to post the petition on every wiki which doesn't want to have anything to do with Wikia no more | Cartoonist | Talk to God! OMFG, HE WENT BANANAS!!! | 17:48, 25 Yoon 2010 (UTC)
